S3E54 – Jim Sheils – Passive Income with Build-to-Rent Real Estate

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Key Timecodes

• (00:45) – Show intro and background history
• (01:57) – Deeper into his background history and business model
• (04:49) – Understanding his “build to rent” model
• (07:33) – Deeper into the business model and strategies
• (11:38) – How his model can help people to achieve financial freedom
• (15:12) – Deeper into his strategies with the properties
• (19:38) – How investors can work with him
• (21:08) – A bit about his educational model
• (21:50) – How about his book “18 Summers“
• (26:38) – What is the worst advice he ever received
• (26:50) – What is the best advice he ever received
• (29:17) – Guest contacts

Transcription

[00:00:00.000] – Intro

Hey, this is Sean Tepper, the host of Payback Time, an approachable and transparent podcast on financial independence. I’d like to bring on guests to hear authentic stories while giving you actionable takeaways you can use today. Let’s go. My next guest spent three years in corporate America, decided this is enough for me. He found a quote that said seven out of 10 millionaires build their wealth with real estate. Building wealth was one motivation, but his true North Star was creating passive income so he could spend more time with his family. In this episode, we talk about the build to rent model, some of the benefits of this model, and how investors can start creating passive income with less upfront capital. Please welcome, Jim Sheils.

 

[00:00:45.810] – Sean

Jim, welcome to the show.

 

[00:00:47.220] – Jim

Thanks for having me, Sean. Good to be here.

 

[00:00:48.270] – Sean

 Absolutely. Thanks for joining me. So why don’t you kick us off and tell us about your background?

 

[00:00:53.250] – Jim

Yeah, I mean, just like a lot of people out there, I got out of college and went into corporate America in something I really didn’t enjoy. And for two years I really suffered. And for the third year I was suffering and searching. And I fell sideways into real estate investing because it made sense to me. There was tangibility. And I read a stat that said seven out of ten millionaires in the US had made their money in real estate. And I like those odds and the flexibility. So I started a journey into real estate investing many years ago, 24 years ago. Wow, it’s even weird to say that with ups and downs and then survived the ’08 meltdown and then actually got into one of what’s now considered one of the most lucrative real estate investing niches, which is called Build to Rent. It’s now a company where I help people build rental portfolios, new construction properties. We work with almost 1,000 investors now and been able to help retire or semi-retire several other people and their families along with my own, which has been a pretty exciting quest.

 

[00:01:56.820] – Sean

Got it. We’ll dive into this build to rent model here in a second. It’s actually a new concept I have not heard on this show, so this will be good to dive into. But let’s just back up a second and talk about your transition points. I heard 2-3 years in corporate America. Did you work for corporations any time after? Did you make a transition point going back 24 years?

 

[00:02:21.720] – Jim

I made that transition going back 24 years. I had interned between junior and senior year at a nice group of people, but it was a pharmaceutical ad agency, and it was almost as boring as that sounds, putting together pamphlets and brochures for irregular bowel syndrome and fun stuff like that, and then didn’t know what to do out of college and just went into that. What I got clear on was I watched where the people who were four levels ahead of me, which I was supposed to be working towards, well, I was working long hours. They were working really long hours. It didn’t seem like they were gaining more freedom or buying back their time to be doing stuff they might want to be doing with their family or their hobbies. In fact, they were losing that more and more. That was a big aha for me in my path. I cut my teeth pretty hard, Sean. Now, and all things said, I didn’t have a family at the time, so I could starve myself a little bit, which is a big factor, I think, in some of this that people need to know. But I cut hard and I’ve never really gone back into the corporate America realm at all.

 

[00:03:28.680] – Jim

I’ve remained an entrepreneur since then.

 

[00:03:30.720] – Sean

Got it. When you made the transition, what real estate did you get into? Was it single-family or were you flipping homes? What were you doing?

 

[00:03:37.870] – Jim

I started by doing just a simple model of buying, fixing, and reselling small single-family homes. That was mainly what I did. And once I started to get that down, I started to actually hold a few of the properties as rentals, and then I started to get hired by other people to do that work for them. And that was the evolution of my business. But I’ve still now, I’ve done thousands of rehabs now in my career, and now I’ve built thousands of homes. People are like, Well, why do you still work in these little properties, single-family homes and duplexes and sometimes quads? I said, Well, now I’m just starting to get good at it. I guess people always say, Well, if you’ve done that many, you have to go into big commercial buildings and this and that. I’ve done a little of that, but I’ve really become comfortable to get to you’re a freshman and then you become a senior. I like being in my niche where now there’s a lot of second nature, not a lot of overthinking. And it’s nice not to be the newbie. And so that’s why I’ve stayed within this niche for so long, and it serves the purpose of the time I get with my family, lifestyle I want to live.

 

[00:04:46.060] – Jim

And so I just haven’t seen a need to go elsewhere.

 

[00:04:49.600] – Sean

So tell us a little bit more about this build to rent model.

 

[00:04:53.470] – Jim

Yeah, build-to-rent was a term that came out about 10 years ago. A lot of people out there have probably heard or watched the shows, Hey, you find a distressed property, you fix it up and you rent it or you sell it. And Sean, that one sentence right there was what took me from very low financial means to more wealth abundance. I learned how to find an old home, fix it up and either rent it or sell it. That was my whole niche, and it’s a good niche, but it’s not quite as fun as the TV shows make it out to be. Surprises and drama, that’s not where you want to have it when you’re building a real estate, rental portfolio, or doing houses, especially if you have a job and you’re going to be doing this. And so what we found was after about almost 10 years ago, past the 2008 meltdown, I’ve been doing a lot of foreclosures, and there just wasn’t the deals that we used to find. And my now partner and I, a building partner, we both were doing a lot of these renovations on old houses. He actually had the aha, and he said, Well, what if we could just build our own properties from scratch?

 

[00:05:58.750] – Jim

I have a building license. I said, Oh, that’s interesting. We started to build properties, single-family homes, duplexes, and quads that could be used for rent for ourselves and for other investors that we used to be hired by them to find old houses, fix them up, and then get them rented for them and manage them. And so what we started to do many years ago was almost 10, now let’s just do that with new construction. And the reason I did this, Sean, is it’s great to own properties, but if I had one lesson that I can impart, I’ve learned from years ago, it was this thing of being the 100-house club, own 100 houses. Your life is set. Well, I got into 100-house club and way beyond. But I found that it’s the quality of the houses you own, because those can actually stifle your lifestyle. They can actually imprison you if they’re not in high quality, they’re not producing the rents that you’re wanting. What I learned was I want to own less property of better condition, and that’s it. Own less of better condition, better quality in better areas. That’s how I work today with myself and my clients, and that’s what build-to-rent is.

 

[00:07:06.210] – Jim

You can avoid a lot of the maintenance and repair headaches. Tenant turnover is less than new construction. You can own properties in better areas, which makes it easier to manage, it’s safer, and also produces better results overall. It was a mistake that we found build-to-rent, but now saying that being this big rehaber for years, I hung up my rehab shoes about seven years ago, and all I do is new construction now. Just looked at both sides and it’s better for me. It’s better for our clients because we don’t want guesswork. We don’t want surprises. We don’t want involvement. In fact, for what we try to do with our clients, we don’t want them spending more than a half hour a month looking over their portfolio statements, and that when you have older homes and tougher areas, there’s usually a lot more management intensity that you get dragged into. We don’t want that for our clients or for ourselves.

 

[00:07:57.140] – Sean

Right. Now, when I look at a build-to-rent situation, you got to build a new property from scratch instead of renovating or making some updates in an existing property. It sounds a little more capital intensive upfront with the build-to-rent. Is that correct?

 

[00:08:13.230] – Jim

Actually, it’s not. What we do, Sean, is in some typical things where you think of build-to-rent, you’re going to find a builder, you’re going to put up additional money, and then you’re going to have to qualify for a construction loan, which is a lot of paperwork, a pain in the tail. When someone buys a build-to-rent with us, we’re taking on the risk phase of the build. The building phase, we take it. You put up a deposit, but that deposit goes towards your down payment. We are doing the build and they’re just stepping in right at the tail end and getting a permanent loan to put on the house and finance it. We take the risk period of the build on our shoulders, so they just step into a finished new construction product. The way that our building works is you can normally, because we’re constantly building, we have over 6,000 lots in Florida that we’re building out right now, we don’t release the properties till they’re done or within 90 days of completion. They’re stepping in right at the tail end on a new construction property to be able to buy it without a long wait.

 

[00:09:11.580] – Sean

I like the idea of less maintenance. That’s one thing that talking to a lot of real estate investors on this podcast, that’s one issue. You have these older homes and you’re doing more maintenance, you’re getting more calls, and then you’re like, Why did I get into real estate investing? This is a complete headache. It’s like a fresh new car. I’m biased. I drive a Toyota and I like vehicles that last you 200,000 miles plus. You don’t have to worry about much. Well, the same thing in your situation, you’ve got these reliable homes with less maintenance. It’s a good way to go.

 

[00:09:45.080] – Jim

My Toyota 4runner is parked in the driveway right now, Sean, and I love Toyotas and the new construction. The great thing about real estate is there is a momentum too. There is a positive snowball effect. Yes, there’s going to be periods where there’s down times, but if you look at the overall trajectory, in any 10-year period, there’s been growth. That’s why I’ve liked real estate in certain areas that doesn’t seem to be stopping. If you can get something that’s solid, especially right at the beginning, you start to get the wind at your back as cycles continue to move forward. And it’s so much easier with high-quality properties that need less maintenance and repairs that have less turnover. And that’s what we want. Again, people are like, Wow, you own a lot less property than you used to. I said, Isn’t that a lot less property than I used to? But I have more equity than I ever have, and I have more cash flow than I ever have. And that’s what I think is really important that the build to rent model is showing me.

 

[00:10:41.520] – Sean

Is that because just to drill in the numbers here, you’re making higher profit margins because you can charge more?

 

[00:10:47.930] – Jim

Well, what happens is I got planted into better properties that have grown now and the rents have grown stronger. The values have grown. They’re in strategically placed, more advantageous areas. I just got the wind at my back. When I owned more properties of lower value and more deferred maintenance condition, I was always throwing back into a tenant turnover, an unexpected big repair. It was just a trading back and forth of time, effort, and dollars. And yeah, there was some growth, but it seemed like I was paying back into the property so much and the extra intensity of managing that much more property. And yeah, I’ve just consolidated my portfolio to be better quality, less leverage, and in better condition.

 

[00:11:39.130] – Sean

Now, do you help people along the route? Because we’ve got a lot of people listening to this podcast that they’re working a full-time job and they’re trying to figure out, okay, what can I do to create more freedom in my life, spend more time with my family? I know you’re really big on that. I read about you on your site and some of the notes on you as a key driver here with what you do is to spend more time with your family, have that freedom. If somebody’s like, Hey, I’m in this corporate job. I’m not excited about what I do, can they approach you and you coach them or maybe even help them with the investment process so they can maybe get a hold of one of these properties and create passive income?

 

[00:12:17.800] – Jim

Yeah, we have nearly 1,000 investors right now and growing weekly, where we’re always working with people with just that. They’re trying to buy back their time and be able to do the things they want to do. The nice thing about having, I know everyone talks about the corporate job and the corporate grind. I was just explaining mine. You want to look at your situation of where is the silver linings? The great thing about real estate investing, especially when you team up with a full-service real estate company. There’s good ones out there and there’s bad ones. You want to do your homework, you want to look at their history, but let’s say you get to one and you can work with them. Well, with your corporate job, you have what’s called income, which is great for qualifying for bank loans. Bankers love you. More than even my file with things, it’s very straightforward. It’s very strong income. So you can start to side hustle into real estate while you’re still in the corporate grind. Take advantage of that W2 that they love to see. You can get great government loans. And with the loan programs, we actually do in-house financing, where with those great files, like someone who has a corporate job, they can qualify.

 

[00:13:30.700] – Jim

We’re locking them in at 4.75 %, two and a half % what normal rates are out there right now. So that helps with their cash flow. I always tell people, when you get out of your corporate job and you make that leap, the first thing I had to do was replace that income. And that can be a little scary. That’s why I’m like to have a plan of starting to transition can be really good. And with buying properties, you can save, you can invest. You can save, you can invest, take advantage of being able to qualify for loans because too many times, man, Sean, I saw people quit their jobs saying they wanted to get into real estate and they’re like, I can’t qualify for any loans. I’m going, Gosh, I wish you had talked to me six months earlier. Stay with the job. Let’s make out a three year plan where you’re starting to invest and you’re getting properties under your belt, you’re starting to have assistance cash flow from your portfolio. But that’s the advantage where I think people have to look at. Take advantage of your, it’s called serviceability. You’re able to qualify for a loan and good loans, and then you can be having a transitional plan.

 

[00:14:33.060] – Jim

And that’s the nice thing about real estate. You can do it on your own. It’s not like you have to go into it full-time.

 

[00:14:37.400] – Sean

I 100 % agree. I’m really big on bootstrapping with, for example, my company is a software as a service of SAS. We serve the retail investor and pretty much did that for three plus years, bootstrap, keep full-time job. It’s not glamorous, but don’t have to put the burden on the business to pay bills and whatnot. Well, the same thing goes for what you’re talking about here is have that three, maybe five year plan, keep the corporate job, but get things moving on the side, get that first property, then a second property. I know it varies from person to person and how much revenue or profit a property can provide per month, but what is a good benchmark the average investor should go for? They should, Hey, I should aim for maybe five properties or 10 properties. Do you have any number there?

 

[00:15:26.820] – Jim

Well, the good thing is an average property right now can start at a few hundred dollars a month, which doesn’t sound like much to most people. But once you start to add more bricks to your plan, that can grow quickly because what starts out as a few hundred dollars, I’ve seen this, can grow over a short amount of time as rents grow to a thousand dollars a month or more. And so planting the seeds with positive cash flow starting at even if it’s a few hundred dollars a month and as long as it’s in great condition, in a good area, these are things to look at because for me, there’s ways where I could have gotten a higher cash flow, but I would have had to go into a more marginal area. I had to go with more deferred maintenance or potential for maintenance and repairs, potential for harder tenant management, and I just didn’t want to do that. So for me, I always have people start with looking for a few hundred dollars in cashflow, which is going to produce a good cash-on-cash return, definitely more than they’re going to get in basic bank accounts or anything like that.

 

[00:16:32.060] – Jim

That starts to plant the seed for both value growth and rental growth. As you have a little bit of patience and wind behind your back in a few short years, you can be in a great position of having this residual. We’ve had people build this residual up to over $20,000 a month with some patience, reinvestment, and continuing to buy properties.

 

[00:16:53.540] – Sean

Right on. This is all single-family duplexes or quads.

 

[00:16:58.800] – Jim

That’s residential real estate. Anything that’s four units or less is considered residential real estate. Now, the best parts about residential real estate is that’s where you can get 30-year loans. You go into commercial, you might get 20 or 25, and that changes the thing. And also you can get 30-year fixed, where your rate is fixed for 30 years. In commercial, you might only get it fixed for five years. What if all of a sudden you come out at a time like now on a five-year fix, and now you have to refight a much higher rates? It can be very dangerous. So residential has always had the best financing, where you can get the loans the easiest, you get the best rates, you can get the best rates, you can get a 30-year am. We only build properties that you’re able to get residential financing on.

 

[00:17:42.230] – Sean

Got it. And all the properties you’re building, since you’re located in Florida, is everything in Florida? Or are you looking at other states.

 

[00:17:48.730] – Jim

As well? We’re in Florida. Our parent company, which is part of our company, was bought a year ago by a group called Sumitomo. Sumitomo is, you’ve seen Warren Buffett talking about them, they’re a conglomerate in Japan, and they’re a 331-year-old company. They’re on about 30 builders now in the US. We’re one of the part owners that they have ownership with now. They’re already set up in two markets we really like, and that’s Texas and Tennessee, just for landlord laws and for growth migration patterns we’ve been seeing, we’d like to go there. But right now we’re in about 12 different markets in Florida that we see great population growth, economic growth. There’s good affordability to be able to cash flow the properties. There’s a supply issue that we’re fulfilling. The supply and demand is in our favor, and they’re desirable. People want to live there. They want to move there. Those are the five factors we look for. At this time, it’ll be Florida. Next steps will be Tennessee and Texas.

 

[00:18:47.800] – Sean

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[00:19:48.950] – Jim

We are very focused on education. So when our clients come aboard, one of our sales specialists who’s worked with tons of clients and building portfolios, they assess what are you really looking for? What do you have to start with? Do you want to understand more and build to rent? We are video kings. We love doing videos on anything from the markets to interest rates to the flow of why new construction works. What is the difference between a long term rental and a short term rental? We really try to educate our clients from our experience. How does management work? What are the fundamentals you look for building in a certain market? So that way they completely understand, I think it was Warren Buffett, you and I were talking for the call, off it says don’t invest in anything you don’t understand. We try to make it so it’s at a fifth grade level, because really residential real estate investing can be at a fifth grade level. It doesn’t have to be more complicated than that. There’s a few moving parts, a few levers to pull, and we try to educate around that and then keep them educated on market updates as they go along.

 

[00:20:49.850] – Jim

But the starting point is to figure out what are your goals? What are you trying to do? What do you have to work with? What are you wanting to see as a result from this? And then we can work backwards into it. We have a staff of 175, so we do have a good size team that helps make this all happen. It’s not just me and my partner, Chris, who’ve been effort to this.

 

[00:21:09.220] – Sean

Now, is this education, is this part of a course or a module people have to pay for, or is.

 

[00:21:15.030] – Jim

It all free? Actually, we give away our content for free. Our model is based around providing good new construction properties, and that’s our revenue source. And we want to have our people educated as best as possible around build to rent, around real estate market updates, interest rates, everything. And just how did I build my own real estate portfolio to produce up to 40 grand a month in my own cash flow? That’s just for my investments. We want to share those things so people can follow suit. But that’s not part of our revenue model.

 

[00:21:50.410] – Sean

Sure. Before we transition to the Rapid Fire round, I want to ask you a fun question here. I found this in some of the notes about you, and that question is, you wanted to create some freedom because you’re looking at 18 summers with your children. Can you dive into that a little bit?

 

[00:22:08.310] – Jim

Yeah. A mentor of mine taught me that years ago. He said you got 18 summers with your kids. There’s a study actually that shows it’s like almost 85 % of the average people out there will have be done with the quality of time with their children by the end of their 18th summer. It starts to make sense. That number just really was a positive, haunty for me of saying time passes. We don’t want to miss out on this time. Actually, my wife and I have a family education company called 18 Summers, along with a book that actually was a Wall Street Journal bestseller. It talks about how do you make the most of those 18 Summers? Because a lot of business mentors out there many years ago used to teach, put your head down for the next 10 years, your family will understand. I think that is horrific information. I think that’s terrible coaching. Yes, you and I agree wholeheartedly because those years don’t come back. A mentor and friend of mine, David Bach, who’s nine time best selling, New York Times best seller, he always said to me, Jim, the years are not all equal.

 

[00:23:08.080] – Jim

And that always stuck with me. 18 Summers is about do the math. You might have a nine year old right now, but when you look at it in the terms of 18 summers to really make that impact, you’re like, Wait a minute. I’m already halfway through. I only have nine summers left. And since I have this range of children now from two to 20, I have five kids, I’ve been able to see quite a gamut. And these years are fleeting. I think it’s really important to make sure there’s success in business and success at home at the same time. And that’s what 18 Summers was for me, is keeping it on the forefront, keeping that rhythm of being successful in both. And it’s not about, Well, I’ll get back to family in a few years, or once I reach this benchmark, then I will. It’s a very sad strategy that I’ve seen play out bad for so many people.

 

[00:23:58.880] – Sean

Work smarter, not harder.

 

[00:24:02.190] – Jim

Yes. And taking quality time with your family is not something you should ever feel guilty about. It’s something that you’re working towards. You should take it. You should enjoy it. I find that people that do, they might get more done in five hours than the average person does in nine hours because they’re going to be really effective with working out. They’re going to be rejuvenated. I think that’s how I work. I am far from a workaholic now. I do work, but I spend a lot of time with my family as well.

 

[00:24:32.430] – Sean

That’s great. You’re speaking to my audience as well as myself. We want that freedom, balance in life. This whole hustle culture is a bunch of BS. I buck the system on that all day.

 

[00:24:45.940] – Jim

Yeah, well, that’s for me, Sean, a legendary family life. When I started really starting to put out, we have a new book my wife and I coming out called The Passive Income Playbook. It’s about buying back your time and having a legendary family life. For me, all legendary family life meant was all the things I dreamed about or wanted to do as a kid and we couldn’t do because we didn’t have the money, I wanted to be able to still do. Then I lost my father two years ago, and he always struggled with money. I said, all the things dad wanted to do that he didn’t get to do, I want to fulfill that. I want to do those things because we had a lot of crossover and I feel honored I can do the stuff he couldn’t. But for me, that’s a legendary family life. Doing the things you don’t give up on the things you dreamed of as a kid and the things that maybe the people before you couldn’t do, you can live out. Right Thank.

 

[00:25:30.370] – Sean

You for your background here and how investors can approach you and maybe get involved with the process. But what I’d like to do next is dive into the Rapid Fire round. This is the part of the episode where we get to find out who Jim really is. I know pressure is on. If you can try to answer each question in about 15 seconds or less. You ready? Ready. What is your favorite podcast?

 

[00:25:55.780] – Jim

Favorite podcast? I don’t want to be self-certain. One of my favorites is the one I do with my wife. We have the 18 Summers Family Podcast. I really enjoy that. I’m a Joe Regan fan.

 

[00:26:05.630] – Sean

Big Joe Regan fan. Okay, all right. What is a recent book you read and would recommend?

 

[00:26:10.920] – Jim

Recently with my boys, I read The Alchemist. I love The Alchemist. It’s a great book. I’ve read it a few times.

 

[00:26:17.840] – Sean

I just had a podcast right before this. They recommended the same book.

 

[00:26:21.780] – Jim

No kidding. Great story form, good personal development. I highly.

 

[00:26:26.390] – Sean

Recommend it. I love it. All right, movie question. What is your favorite movie?

 

[00:26:30.580] – Jim

Shawshank Redemption.

 

[00:26:32.080] – Sean

Good choice. There’s a few others that’s selected C. We know a little bit more about Jim here. All right, a few business questions. What is the worst advice you ever received?

 

[00:26:44.430] – Jim

I said it before. Put your head down for the next 5-10 years, your family will understand.

 

[00:26:50.380] – Sean

Flip that equation. What is the best advice you ever received?

 

[00:26:54.230] – Jim

The best advice I ever received was really from mentors like I talked about before, where 08 was a hard time for me. I almost went bankrupt in that meltdown because I had so many properties, so much meat and repairs. It was that I have owned less property of better quality with less leverage. It was that simple. That’s been the best advice I’ve had for my own business career. Awesome.

 

[00:27:17.710] – Sean

Did you come to that revelation yourself or did somebody else tell you that?

 

[00:27:21.620] – Jim

It was partially self and it was partially coached. It was revealed to me when going, What could I have done differently where 08 didn’t have to be so painful, so detrimental, so scary. The writing was on the wall from self-reflection and also input from some really good mentors.

 

[00:27:40.120] – Sean

That’s good. I like hearing about inflection points in people’s lives. It’s a painful moment. We can all hit with our business or life and you almost have to take a step back and, Okay, what do I need to change? I know change is not easy, and sometimes you got to arrive there yourself, and sometimes it’s just one person in your circle that says something and it’s like, I got to make this move. I got to do this.

 

[00:28:05.040] – Jim

It’s pretty cool.

 

[00:28:06.490] – Sean

Yeah.

 

[00:28:06.740] – Jim

Very much so.

 

[00:28:07.940] – Sean

All right, last question here is a time machine question. If you could go back in time to give your younger self advice, what age would you visit and what would you say?

 

[00:28:16.110] – Jim

I’d probably go back to about 18, and I would tell myself find forms of alternative education. Because for me, honestly, college was… I love the friends I made. It was a total waste education-wise. I became a good student once I didn’t get grades and I didn’t have to learn syllabus questions, all these classes that weren’t really going to help me with my career. But once I was able to really dive into, well, how does money work? What are some niches that can help me make money? What is personal development? How do I develop better relationships? These are things I had to find outside of normal education, so I wish I had started a little earlier. I started to come into that stuff right at the end of college. I wish I had found it like probably even maybe my 15-year-old self, I would have said, start studying these things now.

 

[00:29:08.870] – Sean

You talk about the frustration of school. I can relate. You were born to be an entrepreneur, that’s for sure. Cool. All right, Jim, where can the audience reach you?

 

[00:29:22.080] – Jim

Yeah, if they want to learn more about our Build to Rent program, how we bought back our time and did it through Build to Rent, they can go to JJplaybook. Com. That talks about our principles and fundamentals of real estate investing, the lessons we’ve learned and how they can work with us and how we’ve expanded that into our family life. Also, if they want to learn about 18 Summers, more of our passion project education company. They can go to 18sommers. Com.

 

[00:29:47.170] – Sean

Awesome. All right, Jim, thank you so much for your time. We’ll see you. Thanks, Sean. Hey, I’d like to say thank you for checking out this podcast. I know there’s a lot of other podcasts you could be listening to, so thanks for spending some time with me. Also, if you have a moment, could you please head over to Apple Podcast and leave a review? The more reviews we get, the more Apple will share this podcast with the world. So thanks for doing that. And last thing, if you do hear any stocks mentioned on this podcast, please keep in mind this podcast is for entertainment purposes only. Please do not make a buy or sell decision based solely on what you hear. All right, thanks for your time. We’ll talk to you later. See you.