S3E13 Sandy Pollack Don't leave a mess with your finances!

S3E13 – Sandy Pollack – Don’t leave a mess with your finances!
Sandy Pollack – Don’t leave a mess with your finances! A lot of people are focused on building their wealth but what do you do to protect your wealth for yourself and future generations? My next guest is a financial planner and author who places a high emphasis on estate and financial security planning. In this episode, she shares some of the biggest mistakes people make when creating a will or planning their estate. In fact, she shares a specific story where a couple handed down $100M to their children and grandchildren but it turned into a bit of a nightmare. If you plan on handing down your wealth to future generations, this episode is for you. Please welcome Sandy Pollack.

Payback Time Podcast

Payback Time is a podcast for investors. The goal of this podcast is to help make investing approachable and easy to understand. We will interview beginner and experienced investors and ask them to share stories on how they got started, what challenges they faced, what mistakes they made, and what strategy works for them today. The overall objective is to provide you with a roadmap that helps you become a better investor.

Key Timecodes

  • (00:56) – Show intro and background history.
  • (01:46) – Deeper into her background and business model
  • (03:03) – The differences between building wealth and managing wealth
  • (06:58) – Deeper into her philosophy and how to deal with emotions on investing
  • (11:59) – Some examples of mistakes people made after building their wealth
  • (17:21) – The importance of signing a will early to ensure a family’s wealth security
  • (25:57) – A key takeaway that the audience can apply today
  • (30:33) – The worst advice he ever received
  • (30:46) – The best advice he ever received


[00:00:01.900] – Intro
Hey, this is Sean Tepper, the host of Pay Back Time, an approachable and transparent podcast on business investing in finance. I like to bring our guests to hear authentic stories while giving you actionable takeaways you can use today. Let’s go. A lot of people are focused on building their wealth, but what do you do to protect your wealth for yourself and future generations? My next guest is a financial planner and author who places a high emphasis on estate and financial security planning. In this episode, she shares some of the biggest mistakes people make when creating a will or planning their estate. In fact, she shares a specific story where a couple handed down $100 million to their children and grandchildren, but it turned into a bit of a nightmare. If you plan on handing down your wealth to future generations, this episode is for you. Please welcome Sandi Pollock. Sandi, welcome to the show.  
[00:00:58.380] – Sandy
Thank you, Sean. It’s a pleasure to be here.  
[00:01:00.660] – Sean
All right. Well, why don’t you kick us off and tell us about your background?  
[00:01:05.100] – Sandy
Well, I’m originally from Montreal. I live in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada, which is the nation’s capital. I am a graduate of McGill University. I began in the financial services industry right after university. A squash coach who was coaching me at that time had suggested that I enter insurance and financial services, and I thought he was crazy. But he said that the industry was really going through a large transformation and that I should investigate it. And I did. And at the young age of 22, I launched my practice during the middle or the height of a recession in the 80s.  
[00:01:46.400] – Sean
You launched your own business at 22?  
[00:01:49.090] – Sandy
[00:01:49.510] – Sean
Good for you. All right.  
[00:01:51.960] – Sandy
Now, I must say I didn’t launch it on my own. I had some great mentors. I joined an agency who basically mentored you to build your financial advisory practice. And with the help of some very wise, honest, and caring individuals, they guided me through sheer, call it stupidity, call it courage, call it not knowing any better. I was able to build build it, met my husband, who’s a Montreal as well, and he convinced me to leave Montreal after I built my practice and it was doing very well and had to restart again in Ottawa and have and have been serving self employed professionals, family businesses, successful entrepreneurs that have started from very little and have created swaths of employment for the economy as well as wealth. And it’s been my pleasure to help them along that journey. I’m married with three children, a rescue dog named Mia. And as we sit here, we have had about two feet of snow. So it’s a very interesting life that we live. And I’m very grateful and thankful for all that’s happened in my journey and we still continue.  
[00:03:03.500] – Sean
Right on. Well, thank you for sharing your background there. And on this podcast, we try to bring in a lot of people who they can be wealth managers, they can be retail investors. We do bring on real estate investors as well as venture capitalists. And really there’s no limit as long as in the world of business. Now, I really wanted to bring you on because there was a snippet of text that came through. Our process of getting on the show and that snippet jumped out at me and it stated this, building wealth and managing wealth are not the same thing. So I really want to dive into that a little bit. And then we’ll get to in a little bit, you got a book titled Don’t Leave a Mess. We’ll talk about that in a little bit. But first things first, let’s talk about this difference here between building wealth and managing wealth.  
[00:03:51.650] – Sandy
Okay. Well, building wealth is starting out in life, whether you’re building a business, building professional practice. And more often than not, people start with very little and they make mistakes. They make mistakes, they fall on their face, they learn from those mistakes. They keep trying and striving. And these individuals who I call wealth builders are North America’s unsung heroes in the fact that by taking risk, and this could be from starting from mortgaging their home in order to provide capital to working long hours, they employ many people, they feed many families, and the people that they employ with the income that they earn, feed many families as well. And they are visionaries in the sense that they are always looking forward. They come up with new ideas, some work, some don’t work, but they have that tenacity and that resilience and grit to keep moving forward. So at times it can be a little frightening for them. However, they’re courageous people and they are able to keep moving. And as a result, more often than not, they build a substantial amount of wealth. And I’m not just talking about stocks and bonds, talking about commercial property, apartment buildings, other businesses, whether it’s horizontal or vertical.  
[00:05:13.360] – Sandy
They’re always thinking and creative. And once in a while you hear them say that they have fun. Now that’s great. However, managing it is not so fun in the sense that you have to now take a look at everything that you have. And a lot of entrepreneurial mindset people don’t really look at that. They’re looking forward. And when they stop for a second and they look at what they have, there’s complexity that it attracts ax. And what I mean by that is there’s tax complexity, there’s family complexity, there’s community complexity, employment, economy complexity. And when they have to sit back and say, Oh, my God, what do I do with this now that I’ve created it, there’s a lot of people involved. How do I make sure that A, that my own financial security and independence is taken care of? But there’s other people in my world that now I’m responsible for, my family, my employees, could be my banker, accountant, whatever. And that magnitude can sometimes seem overwhelming. And it’s how do you get these courageous individuals to unpack their story, their journey, what money means to them. Initially, it might have been just to put food on the table for their family, but over time it becomes more than that, and they have purpose.  
[00:06:40.560] – Sandy
And it’s to understand that if they can clear the clutter away to really have time to think about what they’ve created, why they’ve created it now, and what they want to do with it, that’s really managing your wealth.  
[00:06:57.490] – Sean
Right. And thank you for your response there. I wanted to give you my input. So I’m starting to talk more and more about four pillars of money management. Piller one would be removal of debt. Piller two would be increasing income, which can include jumping ship to another company, polish your resume, maybe get a job in IT, piller 3 is building wealth and pillar 4 is protecting it. And on those pillars 3 and 4 is what we just talked about here is you’ve got, sounds like you’ve got a lot of people that you work with that are business owners. They have multiple streams of income to really accelerate their wealth. It’s a great way to build your wealth, not just using the stock market like we do. You use compound interest, but we love it when we hear about entrepreneurs that set up a business with one stream, and then that morphs into other streams of revenue to accelerate, but then they run into an issue, what do we do with all this capital we have? And we also have people who, let’s say, you sell properties, a whole bunch of properties, or sell a business completely.  
[00:07:58.660] – Sean
What do you do in that case? Because you’re going to face a tax event, or you deal with the emotions of people and families and inheritances, and how do you deal with that? So I love the fact that you really focus on that fourth pillar, in my world at least, to protect that wealth, to manage it. So let’s dive a little deeper into your specific services. Offline, before we hit record, you talked about the dynamics of families. Maybe there’s an estate planning process you have to really navigate that territory. So you don’t run into those emotional nightmares when something happens.  
[00:08:36.520] – Sandy
Well, I think there’s always going to be some emotion when it comes to money. And I say this because we all have, and I don’t know where I read this, a money script. And it’s what is our relationship with money? A lot of it stems from how we grew up. Did we have wealth, not have wealth? Did our parents talk about it around the kitchen table, not talk about it around the kitchen table? And so really, understanding one’s relationship with money is key when you’re looking at protecting your wealth and transferring your wealth. When there reaches a point in time, and it’s funny when you talked about your four pillars, I found that very fascinating because once you’ve built your wealth, and quite often people don’t even know that they’ve built their wealth, that they have enough, and we call that financial independence. And what financial independence is, Sean, is when you have financial resources that can buy 100 % of your time. And once you’ve reached that point, and quite often a lot of people don’t even realize when they’ve reached it, right? Because they just keep working and they keep building and growing. But once you do, two things can happen.  
[00:09:44.180] – Sandy
Either one, you take the same risks that you took when you were trying to increase your income and increase your wealth and build your wealth, and you can lose it all. Or you continue to take those risks and you end up with a surplus of wealth. And when you have that surplus of wealth, because you can only eat so much. There’s only so much travel, so many cars you can buy. There’s a point where you go, No, I’m happy with what I have. Then you have something that is called excess wealth. When you have that excess wealth, there are essentially three pots that you can consider. Your focus isn’t so much on protecting, your focus is on transferring. So protect what I have for me and my well being till my last breath. But when I have surplus, I really have to think about transfer. And so where am I going to transfer this excess wealth to? Well, the first place you can transfer it is usually what they call family legacy, which are your loved ones, family. The second place that you can transfer your wealth is what’s called social capital legacy. Those are big words to unpack.  
[00:10:47.760] – Sandy
What does that mean? Social capital legacy has two components. One is taxes, whether it’s Uncle Sam, CRA, or any country that you’re living in, death and taxes are certain. Or the other component is social capital legacy, which is charities. So if you can somehow or another plan that excess wealth in a way that’s intentional so that, yes, you can take care of your family, ensure their well being, but also manage it in a way that if I can divert some taxes and do something for social capital, whether it’s a charity that I feel very strongly about or charities or I want to create a foundation, that really is what planning is all about. And it’s thinking. It’s not just doing where we run to our tax accountant and we run to our lawyer to draw up our wills, but it’s really about intentional thinking about what have I built up? Why? If I have too much for me, how do I make sure that I take care of this in a way that won’t result in lawsuits, estate litigation, or families that are broken up because of misunderstandings and miscommunication? And that’s really what the book is about.  
[00:11:59.720] – Sean
Sure. We’ve got a lot of entrepreneurs on this podcast, not just investors, but entrepreneurs that are building businesses with the goal to expand into multiple streams of revenue or sell for a larger liquidity event. And I’d love to hear from you. You don’t have to say any names or give any business examples, but people really gravitate towards stories. So do you have any lessons learned, any stories you can share, mistakes people have made after they built their wealth?  
[00:12:29.280] – Sandy
That’s a great question. Oh, yes, I have seen many mistakes. One in particular was where someone had built an estate, a sizable estate in excess of $100 million. The focus was always on tax, tax, tax, minimization. So what they ended up doing was they ended up setting up a whole bunch of structures to focus on tax minimization. Without explaining anything to their children, their grandchildren, they were obsessed with just making sure that they paid as little tax as humanly possible. Now, don’t forget that these are individuals that have paid taxes throughout the course of their lifetime. They pay property tax, income tax, payroll tax, sales tax. I mean, we’re not talking about people that don’t pay taxes. These are really the engines of any strong economy. But it was to the point that all these tax things were done. And by the way, there was life insurance put in place because we do estate planning and make sure that that is protected. However, they never had the conversation of what the wealth was for. And when they created these trusts, there were some miscommunications in terms of the beneficiaries. And one particular family did not have children, one child, two other children did have children.  
[00:13:50.360] – Sandy
And because of the way that things were worded, the grandchildren felt that one of the buckets that their, let’s say, uncles and aunts had that didn’t have money, really should be for them because the intention was to go to that third generation. And it created a bit of a rift within the family and entitlement, which was totally unintentional. And I think that that could have been averted if they would have taken their children and had a conversation about the fact that we’ve built this. Whether you have decided to have children or not, we want to split it in three ways equally. And then we also want to ensure that if you do have children that it goes that your respective third or quarter goes to your children. But this other couple, let’s say, that didn’t have children, they wanted to be more philanthropic with the gift that was left to them. But there were no conversations. So instead there was, Let’s keep family peace. Let’s do what they want. And yet you could sense a little bit of resentment. I mean, everybody was well taken care of. But I think that there still is this undercurrent among the family members.  
[00:15:05.000] – Sandy
And a flippant comment or two saying that you have spoiled grandchildren or entitled grandchildren, and the grandchildren are not. I think they mean well. But if the wealth founder would have taken the time to do a couple of things. One was to bring all his children together and have a meeting and talk about because they only knew what it was when that person died. Okay, so here’s the big surprise. We think dad’s worth 20 million. Oh, my God, mom and dad are worth 100 million. That’s a huge… It’s like a gulf. It’s like an ocean. Everybody’s expecting a pool and then they get an ocean. So that’s the first thing. The second thing they could have done was talk about the stories of how they built the wealth because behind every wealth builder story, there are such nuggets of wisdom that can be shared with your children and grandchildren or community that people could learn from and used to jump from in order to have even a richer, more successful and meaningful life. So I think that that was somewhat remiss. So, yes, they minimized their taxes, but was their legacy really communicated in a way that it should have been?  
[00:16:19.840] – Sandy
I don’t think so. And I think it was sad because I was recommended to one of the families to help pick up the pieces to say, Okay, if you’ve decided to make this decision, let’s look forward. They had a really interesting opportunity to talk about the family dynamics, what it was like growing up, how humble the parents were, because it didn’t change who they were. I think that just a little more communication and maybe some of their advisors asking them a few why questions would have averted this continuous sense of I don’t know what the right word is. Not clutter, but this undercurrent of stress that’s there. And it’s unfortunate because I think it would have brought the family closer together instead of making the family civil. I mean, that’s just one, but I even have more. But there’s a good example of unintentional planning, looking at only one area instead of really opening your lens.  
[00:17:22.600] – Sean
Thank you for sharing. The listeners here can’t see me, but I’m smiling the whole way because I love stories like this, so vibrant with detail. Do you feel like as well there was a lack of detail or specificity with the splitting and who it goes to? Do you think it was a little vague? The reason I asked that question, I do hear people coming to me talking about their own wills, and it’s just so high level and vague. And I start asking questions like, what about this? And what about this? Oh, I didn’t think about that. I’m like, those things can turn into horror stories if you don’t have everything outlined to a T in your will. What are your thoughts on that?  
[00:18:01.120] – Sandy
Oh, my goodness. Sean, let me tell you, if you… Any of the listeners today, assuming they have a will, you would be amazed at how many people don’t have wills. And if I’ll park that and I’ll explain to you, if you ask me that question, I’ll tell you why people don’t have wills, which is ridiculous. But if they do have wills and you take the will that you’ve written, you’ll be lucky if it’s been written in the last year or two. It was probably 3, 4, 5, 10 years ago, and your situation is totally different. But if you look at the first line in the will, it usually says, I so and so direct my executor to do the following. One, pay all my taxes. Two, pay all my debts. And three, execute whatever I’ve built up as follows. So taxes death. However, if you ask someone, Okay, before we start talking about your will, what do you want to see happen? They always say, I want my family taken care of first. If I owe anybody money, I want my debts to be cleared. And if there’s anything left over, pay the taxman. But it doesn’t work like that.  
[00:19:10.960] – Sandy
So that’s number one. Number two, the wills are very impersonal. They’re very templated, and they’re in a language that no one understands except the person that wrote it, which happens to be a lawyer and is hoping that this is going to be good enough because they’re anticipating perhaps a fight or somebody contesting the will, and it’s got all these legalese. So when people look at this document that’s templated with big words and there’s a difference between an and and an or and an of, and that could totally change what your intention is, you wonder why people don’t want to write a will. Why would I want to write a will that’s not me? It’s all this gibberish that I don’t understand. So I think that what happens is the professionals don’t spend enough time understanding the why, the family dynamics. They give you a form to fill out where you put your name, your date of birth, your assets, your beneficiaries. If you have any charities, thank you very much. And then they plug it in and say, Can you read this again? And what changes do you want to make? You can sign it.  
[00:20:14.440] – Sandy
I mean, that is really you spent your whole lifetime working your butt off to create something to have some person basically say, Check, check, check, check, check, sign, sign, sign, sign. Is that what you worked your ass off for? Seriously. Didn’t you want to say, Oh, I want to leave something to my children for their wellbeing? I want to give something to a charity that I’ve seen has made an impact in the community. Oh, I want to take care of my grandchildren for their education because education was maybe something that I didn’t have and I want to give them a step up or an opportunity. I have yet to read a will that says that. In this book that I wrote, actually, I made a little comment about my late grandfather’s will. He died of a brain aneurysm at 48. Very successful business in Montreal when Montreal used to be the heyday of the fashion industry. It was Montreal, New York, and maybe Hong Kong, I’m not sure. But there were three big where the fashion industry was. He died of a brain aneurysm, and I’m cleaning some papers up in my dad’s house, and I see this and it says, I, Sidney Rubin, leave to my beloved wife, Libby.  
[00:21:29.650] – Sandy
My beloved wife, Libby, I will give someone $100 if they could find my beloved wife, my loving children in a will today. I question that. So what was he saying? W hat did he do? He had a shareholder agreement. They had it properly insured with life insurance because as much as his two other brothers liked my grandmother, they did not want her as a partner. And here was an example, and maybe that’s how come I got into this business was he was so methodical and responsible. They talked about uncomfortable things. They had just built their first house. They came to Canada with very little. My grandmother got a beautiful home paid for. She got cash in the bank that kept her way into her 90s. S he didn’t have to manage the business or get along with her brother in laws. B elieve me, I love my grandmother, my late grandmother. May she rest in peace and be well. However, you wouldn’t want her as your partner. They just had the foresight to plan for those events and talk about it. His will reflected who he was, which was a hard working, loving husband who cared for his family.  
[00:22:39.960] – Sandy
I think that we’re missing that today in this world of sign the forms, document, sign here, sign here, without really putting the thought that I think people need. And they’ve spent their whole life sacrificing and building something up for what? For a lawyer to tell you how it’s distributed?  
[00:22:57.910] – Sean
I see in this case so many people think of creating a will of something I’ll do later or down the road. And if you really want to avoid headaches for your family, for those who are inheriting whatever wealth you have left, you have to do your work upfront. And it’s not going to be glamorous. It’s not going to be pretty. But if you do that work upfront, you can avoid huge headaches for them down the road. I’d see so many circumstances with people. There’s no will or there’s very little effort put into it. It just creates a nightmare down the road.  
[00:23:35.320] – Sandy
There are reasons for that, Sean. Fear. Or superstition. I have that in one chapter, which is why don’t we get it done? Procrastination. One is, and this is true, some people think that if I don’t write my will, I won’t die.  
[00:23:52.900] – Sean
Because you have control over that, right?  
[00:23:55.060] – Sandy
Because I have control over my business, my money, my wealth. So if I don’t do that, I won’t die. Well, it doesn’t work like that. You will die with 100 % certainty. I know we have one life. I don’t know when. I can’t tell you that it will be February 17, 2025, but we will die. So the question is, would you like to have the conversation about what you want and why while you have your faculties, while you’re healthy, or would you rather leave a mess where your kids, your wife, your widow, your widower will say, What were they thinking? Yes. What were they thinking? When people hear the name of my book, every person that’s read this book or hears the title says, Oh, do I have a story for you, Sandy? I got to tell you about a mess that my aunt made. I have to tell you about a mess that my parents made because I’m not talking to my younger brother because of X, Y, and Z. This book is filled with stories and examples, but it’s also filled with tools to help people think, reflect, unpack so that they can actually move forward in their planning in a very thoughtful and intentional way that isn’t like getting a root canal.  
[00:25:13.430] – Sandy
Well phrased.  
[00:25:15.220] – Sean
I love that. Let’s take a quick commercial break. Hey, this is Sean. I’d like to say thank you for taking the time to listen to this podcast. I know there’s a lot of other podcasts you could be listening to, so thanks for taking the time to listen to this one. I have a quick request. If you have a moment, could you please head over to Apple Podcasts and leave a five star review? The reason is the more ratings we get and the higher those ratings are, the more Apple will share us with the world. So thanks in advance for doing that. And then I have a quick comment. If there are any questions you want me to ask the guests, please head over to our ticker Facebook group. You can drop a question right there. I’ll go ahead and make a note and I’ll do my best to ask that question on the podcast. All right, back to the show. On that note, what is a key takeaway our listeners can take action on today?  
[00:26:04.380] – Sandy
The one key takeaway, and again, it goes back to this book, is what I call the price of silence. When families don’t talk, everyone gets hurt. If I would encourage the listeners to just meet with whether it’s your life partner or your life partner and your children to talk about where your stuff is, how you’ve organized it, the stories behind what you have, because it’s not about the money. We do legacy letters for our clients, and I sit down and I get them to unpack how they started, what it was like growing up. I love people stories. I am a junky when it comes to entrepreneurs. I love to hear what they’ve done, how they failed, what they’ve learned. The last part of when we’re putting this letter together and it was all in rough, which they’re going to edit, was, Sandy, I want them to add this to my letter. Look beyond the money, stay together as siblings and stay together as a family.  
[00:27:13.780] – Sean
That’s powerful.  
[00:27:15.840] – Sandy
They did their wills. They didn’t even understand it. They said, Sandy, you know what? We told you we wanted. Can you please read these documents and tell me if that’s what it is? Can you imagine? Of course, I said, Well, you’re going to read it, but I’m going to read it with you and we’ll go through it. But this letter now accomplish that legal document. It is so powerful because what is in these letters or this particular letter was really about some of the hardship, what was important to them, the lessons learned, three important values that transcended time and transcended business and whether it was the Internet. I think that if you can sit down and have that conversation with your family about what you have, the stories behind it, and how you want it to be distributed, whether it’s to charity and what you really want to avoid, that is the one key take away. I think that I have impacted many people just by that one take away. And there’s many more. But this would be your key.  
[00:28:17.580] – Sean
I like it. I’m going to phrase it as don’t stay silent now. Have that conversation. Don’t be afraid to have the conversation. Just move forward. This will help others and your family down the road because as you stated, we are all going to pass away at some point. It’s inevitable. Yes. All right, let’s transition to the rapid fire round. I love your reaction here. Like, oh. So this is the part of the episode where we get to learn a little bit more about Sandi. If you can try to answer each question in 15 seconds or less. You ready?  
[00:28:54.840] – Sandy
I’m going to try.  
[00:28:56.100] – Sean
All right. What is your favorite podcast?  
[00:28:58.760] – Sandy
How I Built This by Guy Rax, I think. Public radio is a great podcast.  
[00:29:04.800] – Sean
I’ve heard of it. Yes. I think you’re the second person I talked to that mentioned that one. All right. What is the recent book you read and would recommend?  
[00:29:12.840] – Sandy
I just finished it, and it’s called The Myth of the Silver Spoon by Kristen Kefler.  
[00:29:19.260] – Sean
All right, real quick, I will expand the 15 seconds a little further. What’s it about?  
[00:29:23.760] – Sandy
It’s about the next generation inheriting wealth, and it’s about unpacking the myth that people that are born with a silver spoon are entitled, and it’s understanding what it’s like to be born in those families so that they can have an aspirational future. It’s about positive psychology for those, I’ll call it, rising generation that didn’t ask to be born into an affluent family, and some of the tools and thought processes to help them find their own who they are as a person, their own confidence, their own calling, without being under the shadow of the wealth holder.  
[00:30:07.500] – Sean
Thank you for the recommendation here. I just added that to my Amazon shopping cart. All right, next question. What is your favorite movie? My favorite.  
[00:30:16.430] – Sandy
Movie, and this is going to sound really hokey, but I watch it every year, is Love Actually.  
[00:30:23.080] – Sean
Hugh Grant, right?  
[00:30:24.160] – Sandy
Hugh Grant and just all the tapestry of stories that go in. And it’s that Christmas feel good, which I just think it’s nice.  
[00:30:32.600] – Sean
Nice. All right. I got a few business questions for you. What is the worst advice you ever received? Have I got.  
[00:30:39.340] – Sandy
A stock tip for you?  
[00:30:42.490] – Sean
Yes. Right. And it all starts there. All right, flip the equation here. What is the best advice you ever received?  
[00:30:51.460] – Sandy
Play the long game and live your values.  
[00:30:56.340] – Sean
Yes, I like that. Stay true to your values is always a hot one. All right, and last business question here is the time machine question. If you could go back in time to give your younger self advice, what age would you visit and what would you say?  
[00:31:11.160] – Sandy
I would visit age 32, and that was when I was building my practice, had a couple of kids. Life was chaotic activities, and I would just say, take a moment to slow down and enjoy instead of rushing.  
[00:31:30.890] – Sean
Great advice. All right, where can the audience reach you?  
[00:31:36.460] – Sandy
Well, we have a website called, which is www. Don’t leave a mess. Ca, where you can find a list of recommended readings. We’re going to be adding it’s a brand new site. It’s only about three months old. If that you can buy books, either you can buy Don’t Leave a Mess on Amazon or books directly from that site. And for whether it’s speaking engagements or more information, that would be where you would go.  
[00:32:03.630] – Sean
Got it. Awesome. Well, Sandy, thank you so much for your time. I love this conversation. I think estate planning and really thinking about the future and how your wealth, that hard work you put in, how do you pass it on your generation? So many people overlook that. T hanks for sharing this episode with us.  
[00:32:20.540] – Sandy
This has been a real pleasure, Sean. I didn’t know what to expect. And I want to thank you so much for your time and allowing me to share a few snippets of wisdom that I hope will help your listeners.  
[00:32:31.380] – Sean
Awesome. Well, thanks, Andy. We’ll see you.  
[00:32:32.800] – Sandy
[00:32:33.070] – Sean
You. Hey, I’d like to say thank you for checking out this podcast. I know there’s a lot of other podcasts you could be listening to, so thanks for spending some time with me. Also, if you have a moment, could you please head over to Apple podcast and leave a review? The more reviews we get, the more Apple will share this podcast with the world. So thanks for doing that. And last thing, if you do hear any stocks mentioned on this podcast, please keep in mind this podcast is for entertainment purposes only. Please do not make a buy or sell decision based solely on what you hear. All right, thanks for your time. Talk to you later. See you.